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Euroleague's internationality
#1
This thread might be interesting for international forum. After the first phases of Euroleague (regular season, top 16) it appears that Americans are leading Euroleague by the number of participants and scoring. So here's the numbers and places:

1. USA players makes 26% (89 players) of all Euroleague players in the league and they score 36,6% (9279) of all Euroleague's scored points.
2. Lithuania. 8, 2% (28) players, 10,2% points (2605).
3. Serbia. 25 players, 1690 points.
4. Spain goes at 4th position with points 1678, but they have less players than Greece 22.
5. Greece 23 players, 1565 points.
6. Croatia 19 players, 1482 points.

Than goes France (17) and Italy (16) with amount of players, but Bosnia and Herzegovina (825) and Slovenia (716) beats them in the points.

Interesting thing is that in Euroleague exists only three teams where more than half of points belongs to national players:

Cibona- Croats scored 73, 5% of all points.

Rytas- Liths scored 54,7% of points.

Žalgiris- 53,4% for Liths.

Surprisingly (?) Partizan is not even close (37% for Serbian players). Locals were practically non existing for Oldenburg EWE (2, 7% of points).Also, locals didn't do anything much for Siena, Prokom and Maccabi.

The only team who played without a single American was Rytas. Maccabi depends on Americans mostly (77,2% of points).

The most international club- Real Madrid.

Here's all the list of participating players and scored points ranked by nationality:

USA 89, 9279
Lithuania 28, 2605
Serbia 25, 1690
Spain 22, 1678
Greece 23, 1565
Croatia 19, 1482
Bosnia and Herzegovina. 10, 825
Slovenia 11, 716
Italy 16, 550
Russia 13, 550
France 17, 546
Turkey 11, 533
Israel 7, 341
Brazil 4, 329
Great Britain 3, 294
Montenegro 7, 272
Czech 3, 235
Australia 2, 234
CAR 1, 218
Senegal 3, 200
Poland 8, 181
Ukraine 1, 157
Argentina 2, 147
Canada 1, 145
Germany 6, 132
Nigeria 1, 124
Gabon 1, 105
Estonia 2, 71
Georgia 2, 54
Cameroon 1, 46
Albania 1, 34
Makedonia 1, 6
Belgium 1, 2
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#2
this is all very interesting, though one could also look at it another way. What percentage and how many points did the europeans combined score? So to add to your list, Europeans were 237 making up for 69% of the total and scored 14519 points or 57.2%. Americans scored about 5.7 points in average (18 games), while euros scored about 3.4 though (this is of course not very accurate as not all players played in all games due to injuries etc, but it is just for the sake of the argument).
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#3
Quote:this is all very interesting, though one could also look at it another way. What percentage and how many points did the europeans combined score? So to add to your list, Europeans were 237 making up for 69% of the total and scored 14519 points or 57.2%. Americans scored about 5.7 points in average (18 games), while euros scored about 3.4 though (this is of course not very accurate as not all players played in all games due to injuries etc, but it is just for the sake of the argument).

Indeed. Still, too many Americans around in Euroleague IMO Smile Personally, I didn't think Liths are doing so well (I mean the amout of players compering with other countries) and Bosnia and Herzegovina surprised really!

The counting is not clear of players that have several citizenship though. I wasn't my work.
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#4
it is not bad to have some americans. it is french, german , polish teams that have over half their roster packed with americans of disputable value that hurt the el
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#5
Quote:Indeed. Still, too many Americans around in Euroleague IMO Smile Personally, I didn't think Liths are doing so well (I mean the amout of players compering with other countries) and Bosnia and Herzegovina surprised really!

The counting is not clear of players that have several citizenship though. I wasn't my work.

Well, if there are too many Americans then Europe should do better job producing scorers and you wouldn't have Yanks overrunning Euroleague. Sports are one of the few things on this planet that are truly MERIT based; no quotas or favorites. Either you can run, jump, score, pass, rebound, assist or you CAN'T, so why should any group, Americans or otherwise, be excluded just because they're talented at what they do?
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#6
Quote:Well, if there are too many Americans then Europe should do better job producing scorers and you wouldn't have Yanks overrunning Euroleague. Sports are one of the few things on this planet that are truly MERIT based; no quotas or favorites. Either you can run, jump, score, pass, rebound, assist or you CAN'T, so why should any group, Americans or otherwise, be excluded just because they're talented at what they do?

That's the problem. many of the americans don't fit the european game and there are actually more suitable european options for their places. it is just a poor management and mentality thing. Of course no one should be excluded if they are talented. But german teams for example should give more chances to their german players rather than packing their rosters with americans, if they ever want german bball to develop
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#7
Quote:Well, if there are too many Americans then Europe should do better job producing scorers and you wouldn't have Yanks overrunning Euroleague. Sports are one of the few things on this planet that are truly MERIT based; no quotas or favorites. Either you can run, jump, score, pass, rebound, assist or you CAN'T, so why should any group, Americans or otherwise, be excluded just because they're talented at what they do?

My points was that Euroleague should progress in the favor of Europeans and Cibona, Rytas, Žalgiris and relatively Partizan showed that it is really possible. These teams used young local players and only couple of foreign players and the result wasn't worse and even better than many team that were filled with USA players and players from other continents (not to mention the differences of budgets). I'm not against internationality or USA players, but I would like to see unique style of European BB remaining.
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#8
Maybe EuroLeague teams see all American players as potential NBA players? Smile Of course nationality is not important but I prefer to see native players in the match. The clubs' decisions... What can we do? Smile
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#9
Definitely agree, there should be a strict limit on the number of foreigners AND naturalized players on every team. In the end it's just a team of foreigners playing for a team from X country, and there's no feeling of ethnic identity.
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#10
To me this seems like an issue of team management as opposed to players' country of citizenship. If a team signs a player or players who do not fit their system, I blame the management for such decision. While there are certainly general differences between the style of play in the US and Europe, which in my opinion get exaggerated by the rogue rules of the NBA, we can make a similar argument about the differences in individual player attributes being better suited for one environment over another, irrespective of nationality.

I certainly agree that from the German national team perspective the development looks dire but if I worked for Alba Berlin, I would only care about the success of the team as this is what my performance would be measured on. Having lived in Berlin and attended many Alba games this past season, I can attest that Alba did an excellent job of putting together a highly competitive squad. Their game was predictable and largely one dimensional but they still got to the Eurocup final. Yes, this was done on the backs of foreigners, albeit Hamman and Zwiener did get some minutes.

I am ok with the division between international and club basketball and do not believe any quota on foreigners is necessary. If a country is worried about the future of its national team then they should invest more in youth development programs. If as the youth develop they can play at a competitive level then they will find their way onto a squad. If that squad happens to be abroad it comes as no loss to the National team and if they young players are not good enough to make a domestic team then it hardly seems fair to penalize the domestic team with a quota. Moreover, if the club can ride on the patriotic sentiment of its international fan base by retaining a national team star then it will only help to create greater interest in the team but I cannot fault either the player or the team when a player moves abroad for a new challenge and/or a pay increase.
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#11
That's a great first post Thup Welcome aboard skangles. I hope to see you posting here more frequently.
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#12
Well in Serbian there was a rule that u can have only 2 foreigners but as they made us play that Adriatic league now that rule is no more.. Maybe this year partizan has 2 good americans though i think Roberts isn't that good. Jan Vesely is checz and those are 3 foreigners in Partizan. We always had 1-2 american players but they were far from the best in our team, now this Mcaleb is doing great so.... But if we had budget to keep our players i dont think we would need any americans, and also Serbs are doing good if u consider that partizan is only serbian team in the competition. Hemofarm will most likely qualify next season and theres gonna be 10 more Serbs Smile
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