NBA lockout - Printable Version +- TalkBasket.net Basketball Forums (https://www.talkbasket.net/forums) +-- Forum: General Basketball Forums (https://www.talkbasket.net/forums/forum-4.html) +--- Forum: NBA (https://www.talkbasket.net/forums/forum-35.html) +--- Thread: NBA lockout (/thread-221.html) |
NBA lockout - skangles - Nov 28, 2011 [quote name='Sagenas' timestamp='1322425941' post='36335'] You see Prokom as good team to improve? Come on, no one is going to give him guarantees and I don't player wishes so, he should get his time by himself, that's what a good player should do. Conquering with a lot stronger players can give you a lot more than being in your own juice. Like you wrote "he should be for so and so years"...come on, then later everyone will say like about Sabonis: "when he came to the NBA he was after his prime". Bullshit. Some European people see NBA as hell and they do wrong. Some players fail, some shine and that's it. We can't force it. Sooner or later he'll have to face that and I can't any reasons why it can't be next season. Maybe he should wait till Scola retires? <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> [/quote] If his personal goal is to be in the NBA then I don't have issues if he goes over next season. My point is that he should keep check on how the other young players are doing as the way that they play will play a major role in whether or not he's going to get much playing time. You are right that he can earn his playing time regardless but if the three lottery picks start playing like lottery picks the Rockets will want to continue to develop their investments. Motiejunas slipped in the draft from a projected high lottery pick to later in the first round specifically because scouts didn't think he was ready to contribute. I think that the Rockets liked the fact that he could stay overseas to develop when they traded for him. Things can and do change so it's not unthinkable that he could come over and contribute next season but it is a risky move if he approaches it blind. NBA lockout - Raze Lupin - Nov 28, 2011 [size="5"]NBA 2011-2012 schedule confirmation[/size] Here is an ESPN article explaining some of the schedule conditions. Looks like Skangles and I were on point. Quote:The plan is a 66-game regular season, ending about 10 days later than usual. The last possible day of the NBA finals would be June 26, two weeks later than the championship series ended last season. Teams would play 48 games within their conference and 18 nonconference games. Teams will not visit every NBA city. http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/index.php?/topic/3657-nba-lockout/page__st__40 NBA lockout - skangles - Nov 28, 2011 [quote name='Raze Lupin' timestamp='1322456461' post='36343'] [size="5"]NBA 2011-2012 schedule confirmation[/size] Here is an ESPN article explaining some of the schedule conditions. Looks like Skangles and I were on point. http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/index.php?/topic/3657-nba-lockout/page__st__40 [/quote] 18 games against non-conference seems totally random. I would have guessed that the split would have been 51 and 15, that would have made evaluating records more fair within each conference. Based on the split that Raze Lupin quoted I can only rationalize the split below: Teams play divisional rivals 4 times (2 home, 2 away = 16 games). Teams play 2 of the remaining conference teams 4 times (2 home, 2 away = 8 games). Teams play the remaining 8 conference teams 3 times (uneven mix of home and away = 24 games). Teams play 3 opposite conference teams 2 times (1 home, 1 away = 6 games). Teams play the remaining 12 opposite conference teams 1 time (either home or away = 12 games). NBA lockout - stefans - Nov 28, 2011 [quote name='Raze Lupin' timestamp='1322448382' post='36340'] Do you think Darko would be good for Serbian NT? He is a great defensive center. leading NBA in blocked shots next to Dwight Howard and Javale McGee. I think Serbija needs him. They only have one true center Krstic. I guess Milovan Rakovic too. Miroslav Raduljica is a hot prospect. Milan Macvan is really a 4 i think. Dusko Savanovic is good power forward. [/quote] Serbia for sure need center.But Darko made some insulting comments about coach Ivkovic. <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/bag.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> So President of Basketball Association of Serbia has probably "permanently " removed him from NT.So he will not be called any time soon <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thup:' /> NBA lockout - Raze Lupin - Nov 28, 2011 [quote name='skangles' timestamp='1322457624' post='36344'] 18 games against non-conference seems totally random. I would have guessed that the split would have been 51 and 15, that would have made evaluating records more fair within each conference. Based on the split that Raze Lupin quoted I can only rationalize the split below: Teams play divisional rivals 4 times (2 home, 2 away = 16 games). Teams play 2 of the remaining conference teams 4 times (2 home, 2 away = 8 games). Teams play the remaining 8 conference teams 3 times (uneven mix of home and away = 24 games). Teams play 3 opposite conference teams 2 times (1 home, 1 away = 6 games). Teams play the remaining 12 opposite conference teams 1 time (either home or away = 12 games). [/quote] This makes too much sense Skangles. <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rofl3.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> One thing I don't think we've mentioned (although I'm sure its been thought about)is the NBA's desire to promote "headline" games. Headline meaning games that get the most press. There are 18 non-conference games 3 more than there are teams in a conference. Using the Lakers as an example, I would say that there 3 extra games will be 1.Celtics, 2.Heat, 3.Bulls or Knicks. I doubt the Lakers will play The Bobcats, Wizards, Raptors for the 3 extra non-conference games. Those 3 extra games will be used for television spots by elite teams. Likewise Dallas extra 3 will probably include the Heat. Miami's 3 extra games will included Dallas, Lakers, OKC!?. Now the smaller market/less competitive owners will complain some about this and grab a bit of the 3 game pie. Still I don't see Dallas/Miami, Lakers/Celtics only playing once. I don't believe that 18 number is random at all. I believe a 65 game season is perfect for the NBA. Every game counts in 65 especially the 50 conference/division games. A few NBA media pundits have said a shortened season is best for the NBA. NBA lockout - TeoTheGreek13 - Nov 28, 2011 [quote name='Raze Lupin' timestamp='1322495354' post='36357'] This makes too much sense Skangles. <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rofl3.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> One thing I don't think we've mentioned (although I'm sure its been thought about)is the NBA's desire to promote "headline" games. Headline meaning games that get the most press. There are 18 non-conference games 3 more than there are teams in a conference. Using the Lakers as an example, I would say that there 3 extra games will be 1.Celtics, 2.Heat, 3.Bulls or Knicks. I doubt the Lakers will play The Bobcats, Wizards, Raptors for the 3 extra non-conference games. Those 3 extra games will be used for television spots by elite teams. Likewise Dallas extra 3 will probably include the Heat. Miami's 3 extra games will included Dallas, Lakers, OKC!?. Now the smaller market/less competitive owners will complain some about this and grab a bit of the 3 game pie. Still I don't see Dallas/Miami, Lakers/Celtics only playing once. I don't believe that 18 number is random at all. I believe a 65 game season is perfect for the NBA. Every game counts in 65 especially the 50 conference/division games. A few NBA media pundits have said a shortened season is best for the NBA. [/quote] Taking into account that NBA's regular season is more for marketing and awards than for basketball, I believe that they must schedule it like you say they will! <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/crazy.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> NBA lockout - Raze Lupin - Nov 28, 2011 [quote name='stefans' timestamp='1322480635' post='36348'] Serbia for sure need center.But Darko made some insulting comments about coach Ivkovic. <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/bag.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> So President of Basketball Association of Serbia has probably "permanently " removed him from NT.So he will not be called any time soon <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thup:' /> [/quote] This is sad example of Highschool politics! What did Darko say? I like Duda but I was not impressed with Eurobasket this year. What about the genius coach for Olympiacos or PAO. Isn't he Serb, Zelimir Obradovic? Serbija has too much talent not to be in the Olympics. Serbija has great centers, power forwards and point guards also the have an amazing basketball school. If you examine talent/school Serbia is top 5 in the world. They can build a better team. I was upset Serbia didn't make it to the Oly games. They should make me the president of the KK. I would only choose talent no social crap. I'm talking bout this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akoYM2rppdg&feature=related NBA lockout - stefans - Nov 28, 2011 [quote name='Raze Lupin' timestamp='1322496192' post='36361'] This is sad example of Highschool politics! What did Darko say? I like Duda but I was not impressed with Eurobasket this year. What about the genius coach for Olympiacos or PAO. Isn't he Serb, Zelimir Obradovic? Serbija has too much talent not to be in he Olympics. Serbija has great centers, power forwards and point guards also the have an amazing basketball school. If you examine talent/school Serbia is top 5 in the world. They can build a better team. I was upset Serbia didn't make it to the Oly games. They should make me the president of the KK. I would only choose talent no social crap. [/quote] Darko said "Old man who don't know anything"...something like that. Zelimir Obradovic is Serbian ,he was coach of Serbia & Montenegro in 2004 on Olympic Games in Greece (last time that we compete).We was only one victory!! But it's not guilt Obradovic,but players who was like "who cares about NT",so it's better to play kids for NT but at least they will fight for it. <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thup:' /> Than some overrated stars... <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/bag.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> NBA lockout - skangles - Nov 28, 2011 Players who signed in China will not be released to return to the NBA this season. This hits the Nuggets particularly hard as they'll be without K-Mart, Wilson Chandler and JR Smith this season. NBA lockout - Raze Lupin - Nov 28, 2011 [quote name='skangles' timestamp='1322520166' post='36379'] Players who signed in China will not be released to return to the NBA this season. This hits the Nuggets particularly hard as they'll be without K-Mart, Wilson Chandler and JR Smith this season. [/quote] I feel sorry for the Nuggets. I enjoy watching the post Carmelo Nuggets style of play. NBA lockout - Raze Lupin - Nov 29, 2011 New CBA (collective bargaining Agreement)changes. ESPN reports many of the A level CBA changes. This is what they were fighting about. [URL="http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/CBA-111128/how-new-nba-deal-compares-last-one"]Look into the new CBA[/URL] Quote:Following a take-it-or-leave-it offer from the league, the dissolution of the players' union, the filing of a federal antitrust lawsuit, and a 15-hour settlement negotiation, the two sides in the NBA labor dispute came to a tentative agreement to settle the players' lawsuit. This agreement is expected to lead to a new collective bargaining agreement (CBA) and allow teams to resume business on Dec. 9 -- with opening day slated for Christmas. NBA lockout - skangles - Nov 29, 2011 [quote name='Raze Lupin' timestamp='1322495354' post='36357'] This makes too much sense Skangles. <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rofl3.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> One thing I don't think we've mentioned (although I'm sure its been thought about)is the NBA's desire to promote "headline" games. Headline meaning games that get the most press. There are 18 non-conference games 3 more than there are teams in a conference. Using the Lakers as an example, I would say that there 3 extra games will be 1.Celtics, 2.Heat, 3.Bulls or Knicks. I doubt the Lakers will play The Bobcats, Wizards, Raptors for the 3 extra non-conference games. Those 3 extra games will be used for television spots by elite teams. Likewise Dallas extra 3 will probably include the Heat. Miami's 3 extra games will included Dallas, Lakers, OKC!?. Now the smaller market/less competitive owners will complain some about this and grab a bit of the 3 game pie. Still I don't see Dallas/Miami, Lakers/Celtics only playing once. I don't believe that 18 number is random at all. I believe a 65 game season is perfect for the NBA. Every game counts in 65 especially the 50 conference/division games. A few NBA media pundits have said a shortened season is best for the NBA. [/quote] If my assumption is correct then I would imagine that out of the 2 same-conference teams that a team will face 4 times, one will come from each division within the conference. Out of the 3 opposite conference teams that a team will face 2 times, I would imagine that one would come from each division. I think we can pretty much guarantee that the Mavericks and Heat will be playing twice. I also would put money on the Heat playing the Cavs 4 times. The league should try to balance the number of quality teams and sh*t teams that each team faces to avoid an unfair balance in schedule. While you bring up a good point about revenue, as a Bucks fan I'd be thrilled if the Bucks extra games were against the Bobcats, Kings, etc. I think that the NBA will put money first Boston vs. LA, Miami vs Dallas, etc. but will still try to avoid having all the good teams play each other and all the bad teams play each other. Here is my prediction on the teams that the Bucks will play an extra time. Eastern Conference - 4 games: Atlantic Division = Toronto Raptors (Bucks fans and Raptors fans hate each other for some unknown reason) Southeast Division = Atlanta Hawks (Atlanta was our last playoff opponent and nobody cares about either team so the NBA is happy) Possible Alternative = Boston Celtics (the Bucks always seem to play the Celtics on national TV and Bogut/Garnett like to punch each other. This could also serve as one of the Celtics' "easy" competition to avoid the clear bias accusations) Western Conference - 2 games: Northwest Division = Minnesota Timberwolves (there is a huge Minnesota vs. Wisconsin rivalry. This will draw local interest for two teams that otherwise will struggle to fill the stands) Southwest Division = San Antonio Spurs (the Bucks play them well, there is a grudge after Ginoboli took leisurely stroll with the ball in hand to hit a game winner last year and the Bucks were supposed to start the season against the Spurs under the original schedule) Pacific Division - Golden State Warriors (Jennings scored 55 against Golden State. Again nobody cares about either team so it doesn't disrupt the overall league planning and the NBA will assume there is some sort of bullshit rivalry between Jennings and Curry because they were both part of the same draft class). Also, I've heard a lot about shortening the NBA season, not just on this board but in the media. While I think that it would make the games more meaningful, I don't see why the league would entertain this from a financial perspective. Think about it, if you are an owner of a team going nowhere that plays in a stadium with a capacity of 18,000 and because the team isn't great they regularly fill 12,000 to 13,000 per game, why would you want to sacrifice any of your 41 home games? You certainly won't do that because it makes the league more interesting. You're not going to get more than 1,00 additional fans per game if the season is shorter and even that may be a stretch. You're also not going to pay the players 75% of the current wages because they're playing in 75% of the games. It's just a quick way to ensure that the league loses money. NBA lockout - stefans - Nov 29, 2011 Thanks on CBA Raze <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thup:' /> <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> I like it where is New contracts limited to max. 5 years length... <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thup:' /> I don't like it "Teams must spend at least 85 percent of the cap in 2011-12 and 2012-13".It's like if this is in Euroleague..Partizan must spend 5-6 millions on salary... <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thudown.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thudown:' /> <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thudown.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thudown:' /> In translation if club with 20-30 millions dollars can make awesome results ,than leave that way. <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> NBA lockout - stefans - Nov 29, 2011 [quote name='skangles' timestamp='1322527288' post='36385'] Also, I've heard a lot about shortening the NBA season, not just on this board but in the media. While I think that it would make the games more meaningful, I don't see why the league would entertain this from a financial perspective. Think about it, if you are an owner of a team going nowhere that plays in a stadium with a capacity of 18,000 and because the team isn't great they regularly fill 12,000 to 13,000 per game, why would you want to sacrifice any of your 41 home games? You certainly won't do that because it makes the league more interesting. You're not going to get more than 1,00 additional fans per game if the season is shorter and even that may be a stretch. You're also not going to pay the players 75% of the current wages because they're playing in 75% of the games. It's just a quick way to ensure that the league loses money. [/quote] Agree <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thup:' /> 60 regular games the best choice <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> NBA lockout - skangles - Nov 29, 2011 [quote name='stefans' timestamp='1322527307' post='36386'] Thanks on CBA Raze <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thup:' /> <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> I like it where is New contracts limited to max. 5 years length... <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thup:' /> I don't like it "Teams must spend at least 85 percent of the cap in 2011-12 and 2012-13".It's like if this is in Euroleague..Partizan must spend 5-6 millions on salary... <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thudown.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thudown:' /> <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thudown.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thudown:' /> In translation if club with 20-30 millions dollars can make awesome results ,than leave that way. <img src='http://www.talkbasket.net/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> [/quote] The difference between NBA teams and European teams is more parity between the owners. Don't get me wrong there are the ueber-mega rich owners like Cuban and Dolan and then there's the just filthy rich owners of the smaller teams. If owners can't afford to spend 90% of the salary cap then they're in the wrong business. The reason for this rule is pretty much to stop the LA Clippers. The Clippers consistently turn a profit by having a fraction of the labor expenses that other teams have. In doing so they have pretty much assured Clippers fans that they will never have a competitive team. Just as guys start developing and demanding higher salaries the Clippers either trade them or let them walk and bring in new cheap young players basically creating a never ending revolving door of young developing talent. It's a great business model for the bottom line and a terrible model for satisfying your customers. Here is when the Clippers made the playoffs in my lifetime: 2006, 1997, 1993, 1992. Now the Clippers will have to spend the money and they already have a great young supporting cast. NBA lockout - Raze Lupin - Nov 29, 2011 ^^They should move the Clippers to Seattle. Does LA really need the Clippers? Moving the Clippers to a less stable market would force Donald Sterling to sink or swim. He's just coasting in a sports friendly demographic. The greater area is so lucrative that the owner of the Sacramento Kings want to move the team to Anaheim which is fairly close to LA. Sac town may not be flashy BUT the fans are loyal and support their team yer might lose it due to poor ownership. I'm glad these so called "small markets" got much of what they want. They need to make better business decisions. Some of these owners are ridiculous.^^ NBA lockout - Raze Lupin - Nov 29, 2011 From [URL="http://www.nba.com/2011/news/11/27/schedule/index.html"]NBA.com[/URL] 2011-12 NBA Schedule Breakdown Regular Season Start Date: December 25, 2011 Regular Season End Date: April 26, 2012 Playoffs Start Date: April 28, 2012 Last Possible Finals Date: June 26, 2012 Individual Team Schedule Breakdown Conference Games: 48 ⢠Play 6 teams 4 times (2 home, 2 away) ⢠Play 4 teams 3 times (2 home, 1 away) ⢠Play 4 teams 3 times (1 home, 2 away) Non-Conference Games: 18 ⢠Play 3 teams 2 times (1 home, 1 away) ⢠Play 6 teams 1 time at home ⢠Play 6 teams 1 time away Back to Back to Backs: All teams with at least 1; no more than 3 Playoff Back to Backs: Possible in second round [size="4"]Official CBA pdf[/size] [URL="https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B_JqVMjKAfLYNzU3YzVlNDAtMDBlOS00Y2UwLWE5ZTItM2RkZTdjN2FmMzI4&hl=en_US"]Summary of the Principal Deal Terms[/URL] NBA lockout - skangles - Nov 29, 2011 [quote name='Raze Lupin' timestamp='1322538886' post='36395'] ^^They should move the Clippers to Seattle. Does LA really need the Clippers? Moving the Clippers to a less stable market would force Donald Sterling to sink or swim. He's just coasting in a sports friendly demographic. The greater area is so lucrative that the owner of the Sacramento Kings want to move the team to Anaheim which is fairly close to LA. Sac town may not be flashy BUT the fans are loyal and support their team yer might lose it due to poor ownership. I'm glad these so called "small markets" got much of what they want. They need to make better business decisions. Some of these owners are ridiculous.^^ [/quote] I would love to see the Clippers in Seattle. I think that when Seattle eventually gets a team they will be called the Sonics, right? I'm pretty sure as part of the lawsuit against the ownership of the now Thunder, Seattle was able to keep the team history and records for a future franchise. The NBA needs to return to Seattle. Another option would be for the Clippers to return to San Diego. It wouldn't be too far for existing Clipper fans (if there are any) so they wouldn't really piss off their fan base. OK they would but only because Los Angeles locals are in a bit of a fantasy world. Of course the Clippers would need an arena in San Diego but I guess the same holds true in Seattle. Since the NBA has a desire to put teams in Seattle, Las Vegas and Kansas City, I am happy for any team not named the Bucks to end up in one of those locations. The Grizzlies were likely one of the first teams to move but after their success last season they may actually draw some fans in Memphis this season. By the way what about the rumors earlier this year that the Vancouver Canucks owner was looking into buying the Hornets and moving them to Vancouver? I'd love to see it happen. NBA lockout - Raze Lupin - Nov 29, 2011 Yeah I'm sure they would be called the Sonics. Blake Griffin would look good dunking in green. Following in the steps of the Rainman Shawn Kemp. NBA lockout - Black Urum - Nov 30, 2011 [url="http://www.talkbasket.net/6117-end-of-lockout-explained-vid.html"]End of lockout explained (vid)[/url] |